Vitara Diesel - new in town

[calin SB]

Buna ziua tuturor!

Dupa ce am citit acest forum aproape un an, m-am decis sa cumpar o Vitara.

De vreo 3 saptamini am luat o Vitara in 2 usi, carosata, a.f. 1998, motor 1,9 TD Peugeot. Vinzatorul zicea ca are aprox 68000 km, ca masina a stat pe loc in ultimii 2 ani, etc. Oare sa-l cred?

De la achizitie si pina acum am schimbat uleiul motor + filtru, bujiile incandescente, si am remediat o problema la pompa de injectie. Avea o scurgere pe linga axul "clapetei" de acceleratie. Cu aceasta ocazie s-au schimbat toate garniturile pompei, a fost reglata pe stand, s-a masurat compresia (21-22 fara diferente mari intre cilindrii).

In continuare consider ca ar trebui schimbat uleiul din CV, cutia de transfer, diferentiale.

Mai sunt unele mici probleme cu rugina pe sub masina.

As monta un scut de protectie la motor si CV. Eventual un SL.

Dar pentru toate astea e nevoie de informatie (ce anume e mai indicat, de unde, cit costa), meserias, bani. La capitolele informatie si meserias contez pe ajutorul vostru, in special al celor din Sibiu. Pentru bani, sparg pusculita copilului daca trebuie.

Pozele sunt cele cu care se lauda vinzatorul. Altele inca nu i-am facut.

Calin SB

[Land Niva Luci]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

arata bine ...sa o stapanesti sanatos !!!:2dr

[roly]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Sa o stapanesti sanatos si sa te bucuri de ea.

Te asteptam pe off road la o plimbarica.

Probabil vanzatorul a uitat sa puna prefixul la kilometraj 1 sau chiar 2.

Oricum este irelevant, daca masina se afla in stare tehnica buna, km sunt un lucru neglijabil.

Ce te sfatuiesc eu, inainte de orice modificare,este sa faci un service total al fluidelor si celorlate consumabile.

Nu trebuie sa spargi pusculita copilului:g

In ceea ce priveste service-ul, modificarea vitarei tale faptul ca esti din SB o sa iti fie de folos.

Ma poti suna oricand, sau pe PaulSB daca iti putem fi de ajutor.

Ai totusi grija la motorul de Peugeot, caci are o tendinta de a se supraincalzii.

[uzi]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Sa o stapanesti sanatos si sa te poarte unde vrei

[dr5an]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

oare postul meu de mai devreme a deranjat pe cineva????????????????????????

[Land Niva Luci]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

oare postul meu de mai devreme a deranjat pe cineva????????????????????????

 

 

ce post frate.??..ca ai decat unul..????:old

[dr5an]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

in primul rand nu suntem frati.

in al doilea rand era un post in care il ghidam pe colegul din sibiu catre niste persoane avizate sa il ajute in ceea ce cauta.

in al treilea rand rog un moderator sa sterga posturile off topic.

Multumesc anticipat si o sa trec pe la prezentari probabil.scuze pentru neglijenta.

[Land Niva Luci]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

in primul rand nu suntem frati.

in al doilea rand era un post in care il ghidam pe colegul din sibiu catre niste persoane avizate sa il ajute in ceea ce cauta.

in al treilea rand rog un moderator sa sterga posturile off topic.

Multumesc anticipat si o sa trec pe la prezentari probabil.scuze pentru neglijenta.

 

 

dimpotriva...aici in comunitatea :clsuntem toti prieteni,amici,colegi...si cunostinte sau pur si simplu ne respectam intre noi chiar daca nu ne cunoastem,avem cel putin o pasiune in comun...daca ai venit cu gand de razboi pe aici..nu trebuie sa rabufnesti asa..nu e locul potrivit,nici aici nu scapam de elementele care le intalnim zi de zi??.colegul cu acest topic a cumparat o masina frumoasa si era normal ca la inceput sa fie felicitat..asa suntem noi romanii si postul tau nu a fost vazut de mine,probabil cel sters de moderator ca asta am concluzionat dupa aceea si comentariul "care post frate" a fost facut in necunostinta de cauza..daca te simti jignit cu ceva..e vina ta..dar nu cred ca ai citit nici macar titlul despre regulile acestui forum si cu ce drept sari asa la gatul meu..:uameni

[retty75]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Te invidiez. Pe bune ca te invidiez pentru motorul pe care-l ai. Visez si eu la un motor de 1,9 diesel. Pentru mine ar fi alegerea optima. S-o stapanesti cu placere.

[v-shase]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

ce optiuni ar fi pentru cresterea puterii/cuplului la o vitara diesel? si cam cat s-ar putea obtine?

[roly]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Salutare.

Ai cam urmatoarele optiuni, mai ales daca este Turbo.

1. http://www.tuningwizard.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1276

2. Tuning a Peugeot 306 Turbo-Diesel (mechanical type)

 

After a lot of people asking for help in this area I've decided to put this page up. It is not my own work and I cannot remember who originally forwarded me this document. From what I have heard it has originated from the Peugeot Sports Club forum and been passed around and re-written many times. The copy you see below is how it was taken from the document I was sent.

 

I will be re-writing this document as I get the pictures together, along with observations and my own experiences with my turbo-tweaking. I'll also say that I will in no way be held responsible for ANYTHING you do to your own vehicle, this guide is for your information only.

 

** Update 28/04/04 ** Some information relating to solenoids and switches has been removed to avoid confusion. I the original document it was suggested that a solenoid could be used as an "economy" mode. This has since been shown to have no effect on economy or performance.

 

**Update 18/06/04 ** Added some more details to help people find the right tools before you start.

 

 

 

Engine

The modifications I have carried out are only applicable to the pre-HDI engine car, i.e. the engines with the Bosch or Lucas Mechanical fuel injection pumps.

 

When I drove the standard car I felt the mid-range power was good, but the throttle response under 2000 rpm was tardy, turbo lag noticeable and the top end rev range was restrictive.

 

 

 

Injection Pump and Fuelling

The majority of the improvements to the power band are achieved by increasing the maximum fuel setting and the boost compensator fuelling. The standard car like all diesels is set-up very lean. The procedure to adjust the fuelling is not difficult, but requires many careful and small incremental changes, and many test drives until the optimum settings are found.

The limit of the performance is related to either the amount a smoke produced or/and the reduced fuel economy that can be tolerated. The smoking is un-burnt diesel, which is mainly seen when the engine is laboured off-boost i.e. under 2000 rpm.

 

The tuning technique I've used is derived from many sources, you will not find any information on this in the Haynes manual as it's not a maintenance procedure, and the text will state 'recommended only by an authorised dealer'. Do n't be put off, it's not that difficult.

 

 

 

Boost compensator Fuelling

The maximum fuel setting has the greatest effect on performance controlling about 80% of fuel delivery, for this reason I would adjust the boost compensator fuelling first. The procedure to increase the boost compensator fuelling is similar on both the Lucas and Bosch pumps. The boost compensator unit can be recognised by a brass coloured diagram assembly connected to the intercooler by a vacuum hose. Unscrew the external 14mm lock nut and turn the adjuster anti-clockwise. The adjustment range is about 1.5 to 2.5 turns (adjustment can be made in half turns). The setting is not so critical; running the car rich from the compensator does not make a great performance difference.

 

 

 

Maximum Fuel Settings

The maximum fuel setting is located in different positions for the Lucas and Bosch pumps. On the Lucas pump a large plastic plug is found on the front of the pump. This must be unscrewed and the pump will empty its contents of diesel. Put a plastic bag over the alternator to protect it. Using a small mirror look inside the pump and you may see a hole with a recessed socket head bolt. I think it's about a 5mm size Allen key. If this can not be seen put the engine in gear and rock the car. You will see a cylinder assembly rotate in the pump. It will need to rotate about 180 degrees to reveal the maximum fuel screw. The screw will need to be turned clockwise. To access the screw you will need to insert the long part of the Allen key. Don't use a ball type driver, as the ball may break-off in the pump. The screw to quite tight and so a spanner will need to be used on the end of the key. The range of adjustment is a relative 20 to 40 degrees (40 degrees is rich, make adjustments in about 10 degree increments). Replace the plug; prime the pump and test drive. Look for evidence of smoke off-boost. Repeat the procedure until the desired performance, smoke level and economy compromise is reached.

 

With the Bosch pump the procedure is much easier. The maximum fuel screw is located on the top right side of the pump. It will have a tamper proof fitting on it, which will need to be removed. This screw is adjusted clockwise up to about 90 degrees (again use about 10 to 20 degree increments).

 

 

 

Maximum Engine Speed

Another simple modification I did was to raise the maximum engine speed to about 5,200rpm (See the Haynes manual). Although I don't rev the engine above 5,000 rpm it has allowed the engine to rev freely to 5,000 rpm, as the standard rev limiter effects the engine at about 4,600 rpm onwards. The improvement is seen when accelerating through the gears.

 

 

 

Idle Speed

I increased my idle speed to about 950 rpm. The engine seems more comfortable at this speed, and it helps the engine pick-up quicker from stationary starts.

 

 

 

Turbo charger and Boost

My car is fitted with the Garret T2. The standard boost is 14 to 15 PSI on full load @ 3000 rpm. I have increased the boost to the maximum I believe the T2 can produce on this engine, by shortening the waste-gate adjustment arm. I've heard of some people bending the arm to increase the boost if the threads are ceased, I leave that decision to yourself? The boost I run is about 17.5 PSI @ 3000 rpm under full load, peaking a about 19 - 20 PSI @ 4000 rpm. I've heard of higher, but my gauge is calibrated. My car also develops standard boost @ 2500 rpm, about a 1000 rpm lower than standard. I recommend raising the boost if possible, but the car must at least have the standard boost.

 

The KKK type turbo has a locking nut and adjuster on the end of it. The locking nut I believe is a 13mm or 14mm nut and the adjuster needs to be turned about 1 and 1/2 turns clockwise to turn up to about 1.3bar. The adjuster is turned using a 2.5mm allen key. A 2.0mm key will fit but it will not turn the adjuster properly. See this guide for more info

 

The performance gains above 15 PSI boost diminish quite quickly as the charge temperature raises rapidly. However, if the car produces less than 15PSI boost the increase in boost to standard will yield a relatively higher gain in performance than above. I would not recommend raising the boost above say 18 PSI (peak boost) unless uprated intercooling was used.

 

Remember, the boost pressures and fuelling are not independent on a diesel engine. The waste gate is a final mechanical pressure blow-off, if the fuelling is the limiting factor, additional boost will not be gained. Hence, when tuning the car check the boost as the fuel increments are made. On my car I measure the boost from a 'T' piece I have inserted into the injection pump compensator vacuum hose.

 

The new HDI engine has been fitted with the Garret GT15 turbo which is smaller and more efficient than the T2 it replaced. On driving the new HDI car the engine has excellent low speed pick-up, revved smoothly and is much quieter. However, this turbo being smaller will limit the top-end potential of the engine. The GT15 is designed around 110BHP maximum on a diesel engine, as the bigger T2 it replaced will flow up to about 130BHP.

 

 

 

Summary of the Tuning procedure

 

1. Check the boost, it must be at least 15PSI @ 3000 rpm under full load.

2. Adjust boost compensation fuelling on the pump - set when a small increase in the amount of smoke is seen when the engine is laboured under 2000 rpm.

3. Isolate the boost compensator fuelling as described in note below.

4. Adjust maximum fuelling on pump - set when a small amount of smoke is seen when the engine is laboured under 2000 rpm.

5. Re-connect the boost compensator hose.

5. Check the boost, and adjust the wastegate if necessary.

6. Repeat 4 - clockwise to increase fuel or anti-clockwise to decrease fuel - until the optimum compromise is found for smoke emission, performance and fuel economy. This process of careful adjustment was carried out over a period weeks, I carefully monitored visual smoke emissions and fuel economy during the period.

 

 

Note: To isolate the effects of the compensator from the effects of the maximum fuel screw since the compensator has little effect when set to rich, simply pull-off the vacuum hose from the compensator and plug-off it off with stopper, say a bolt (on the intercooler side !).

 

There are a few Diesel tuners in the business who charge a great deal of money for this process which I've done for friends in about an hour!

3. http://www.swiss-chiptech.com/softwareoptimization_peugeot.html

Ceea ce mi se pare misto este ca iti ofera un boost de 70Nm.

Editat Iunie 15, 2011 de Astral

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Multumesc tuturor celor care mi-au raspuns (atit aici cit si pe PM). Am lipsit o saptamina, fiind plecat din tara, fara acces la net.

Acum, ca am revenit acasa, voi relua punerea la punct a Vitarei.

Cred ca primele 2 operatiuni pentru care voi cauta mesteri vor fi schimbul de fluide din punti si cutii, si micile reparatii de tablarie. Cu siguranta voi apela la colegii din Sibiu, pentru a ma indruma.

Calin

[doru_constantiniu]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Te pot ajuta cu un tinichigiu bun. Mi-a confectionat mie segmente de aripi spate, praguri, contrapraguri si am fost multumit de lucrare. Plus ca te si primeste cu Vitara (la turci nu cred ca te primesc ;))

[pescarul]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Salutare si spor la modificari!! Masina am vazut-o si eu in Bucuresti cam in primavara... Vanzatorul este de undeva din zona Ghencea, Bucuresti nu? La momentul respectiv tocmai o luase si avea in acelasi timp la vanzare o kia sportage. Eu am fost cu un prieten din Bacau pentru KIa si nu a, putut sa nu remarca faptul ca Vitara era diesel si avea si AC pe deasupra. Mi-a placut muilt aspectul ingrijit al Vitarei:))) dar am ramas uimit de neseriozitatea deosebita a vanzatorului(Kia avea trecut in acte un batran de vreo 90 si ceva de ani si el, vanzatorul, avea o hartie scrisa de mana care tinea loc de nushce imputernicire.....)

Sfatul meu e sa-i faci toate verificarile si toate schimburile de fluide vitale inainte de a iesi in teren cu ea pentru ca omul acela MINTE prin toti porii pielii.Daca nu ai trecut-o inca pe numele tau , fa-o rpd chiar si numai pentru a te convinge ca actele furnizate de vanzator sunt bune...

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

@ pescarul Vanzatorul este din zona Ghencea, ai dreptate. Nu stiu daca mai avea la vanzare kia sportage, dar in curte era. Referitor la seriozitatea/ neseriozitatea omului, in ceea ce ma priveste, nu am nimic de obiectat. Primul lucru pe care l-am verificat au fost actele, si corespondenta seriilor de pe masina cu cele din acte. Abia apoi am inceput sa studiez masina.

Unele lucruri erau cosmetizate pentru vinzare, dar am aflat abia acasa (ex: relantiul era marit pentru a nu se aprinde becul de la presiunea de ulei. motorul era spalat pentru a masca o scurgere de motorina din pompa de injectie, pe linga axul acceleratiei).

Am mers cu vinzatorul la primarie unde am luat certificatul fiscal, am facut contractul si abia cind am plecat cu masina i-am dat banii.

Cum am ajuns acasa am facut programarea la RAR, la o saptamina de la achizitie masina era deja pe numele meu (am fost plecat 2 zile din localitate in acea sapt).

 

[pescarul]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

In acest caz FELICITARI si sa te poarte pe unde nu pot sa te urmeze X5-urile!!!!!!!

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Va salut din nou!

A aparut o problema tehnica la Suzi. :hlPedala de frina s-a intarit beton, iar eficienta frinarii a scazut cumplit. As zice ca s-a cam stricat pompa de vacuum. Are cineva idee unde gasesc o pompa de vacuum, avind in vedere ca motorul e de Peugeot 1,9 td, tip DHW (XUD.9 SD)?

Tot cautind pe net dupa manuale de reparatie motor Peugeot am gasit un manual care pare destul de complet, dar e pentru Lada Niva, care se pare ca a fost echipata si cu motoare diesel pejo. Manualul poate fi gasit la http://sqas.nazwa.pl/nivoholics/download/Niva_1.7_Service_manual.pdf Poate le e de folos celor cu Niva.

Orice idee referitoare la reparatia pompei de vacuum e binevenita! Multumesc anticipat!

[dr5an]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

la peujeot 1.9 d sunt 2 modele de pompe de vacum

una pe axul cu came( cum probabil ai) si una pe curea actionata de o fulie care se afla in spatele chiuloasei pe ax

suna la 0748/100887 marius. el dezmembreaza peujeot-uri in sb.

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Multumesc de sfat dr5an!:tk

Il voi cauta luni pe cel recomandat.

La mine pompa de vacuum e actionata de o curea separata de cureaua principala de transmisie. Pompa e situata in partea de jos a motorului, in stinga cum privesc din fata, la oarece distanta sub galeria de admisie-evacuare.

Un amic care a avut citeva peugeot-uri diesel mi-a dat un pont azi, cum ca pompa de vacuum e aproape identica cu cea de Aro. Cel putin garnitura zicea amicul ca e identica ca dimensiuni, forma, etc. Luni voi demonta pompa pt a vedea cum e inauntru, si cu garnitura in mina voi merge la magazinele de piese pt aro.

[dr5an]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

asa este .pompa de vacum actionata de curea este la fal ca cea de aro.

si membrane de aro gasesti sigur.

stiu un prieten care a mai schimbat.

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Nu a mai fost nevoie sa caut pompa din dezmembrari! A fost demontata pompa de vacuum si membrana era sparta. Am cumparat una de aro, este identica ca forma si dimensiuni! Pret .... 5 lei! Manopera a fost ceva mai scumpa!

Sper sa tina cit de mult membrana de aro!

[symy139]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

ii bun ca ti-ai rezolvat problema cat mai ieftin din punct de vedere a piesei. Acu daca ai fost prezent la manopera, sa prinzi si tu miscarea ce o facuto mecanicul respectiv, o sa iesi si mai ieftin pe viitor, poate doar 5 lei membrana, si o bere pentru tine. Cel mai bine e sa asisti si tu la reparatii de genu, la care nu trebuie multe cunostinte, ca pe viitor sa ti le poti face singur.

Vorba romanului, meseria nu se invata, se fura. Asa ca fura cat mai mult, ca asa o sa stii si despre masina cat mai mult.

 

Din experienta, daca o fost ceva la care mio fost frica sa ma bag, a doua oara o fac cu mana mea.

 

Succese, si numai bucurii de pe urma masinii, ca Vitarele is bijuterii in materie de 4x4.

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Va salut din nou!

De la ultima discutie Suzi a facut o vizita la tinichigiu, care m-a scapat de Luminite. E vorba de luminitele care se vedeau prin podea in 2 locuri. Cu aceasta ocazie s-au reparat si zonele unde se vedea rugina care a "umflat" vopseaua. Dupa revenirea acasa am patit alta buba.

A cedat din nou membrana de la pompa de vacuum a servofrinei. Stie cineva unde pot gasi membrana originala de peugeot? De aro se gaseste fara probleme cu 5 lei, dar se pare ca materialul din care e facuta e cam invechit, sau cursa pompei e sesibil mai mare decit la aro si suprasolicita membrana (altfel nu-mi explic cum a cedat dupa aprox 1 luna de folosire). La magazinele de piese zic ca se aduce doar pompa intreaga, care mi se pare cam scumpa (8-900 lei).

Demontand pompa de vacuum am observat ca furtunul ce duce la baza radiatorului e cam copt si vreau sa-l schimb. Diametrul interior e de 36 mm, iar la magazine pe stoc se gasesc doar la dacie cu diam int de 30 mm. Vreo sursa rapida , ieftina si de incredere???

Multumesc celor care imi vor da idei bune.

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Va salut din nou, dupa ceva vreme. Daca nu am scris nimic, nu inseamna ca nu am citit aproape zilnic discutiile de pe forum.

Ma tot framinta urmatoarea idee: discul meu de ambreiaj are 200 mm diametru. Mi-ar place sa pun unul ceva mai mare, 215 mm de exemplu. Dar discul actual intra in volanta, la fel si placa de presiune. Pentru a pune un disc si o placa de presiune mai mare, pare ca ar trebui schimbata volanta, sau macar "scobita" putin, pentru a incapea discul de 215 mm.

A mai facut cineva asemenea modificare?

[calin SB]

Re: Vitara Diesel - new in town

 

Oare sunt singurul care are motor diesel pe Vitara?

Niciun sfat de la cei mai experimentati?